Interview with Don Hale
by Jon Jordan
Web Site

Summer 2003

JON:  What made you want to become a reporter?

DON:  It was always my ambition to become either a reporter or a pro soccer player and just before I left school, I was offered a professional contract to become an apprentice player with Bury FC. I played for about six years for Bury, Blackburn Rovers and many other clubs but became injured and used to sit in the stands and watch the team play. That was very boring until I became friendly with the BBC radio commentator who sat next to me. Gradually I was asked for my comments on the game and started to talk about tactics etc. It all became quite bizarre and amusing and the public seemed to enjoy the talks. I was then banned by Bury for giving too many secrets away and could only commentate on other matches. I was then asked to join the BBC and also wrote for several newspapers and magazines, firstly on sport, then general features, showbiz and news.

JON:  What kind of things besides school shaped your talent?

DON:  I always enjoyed playing or watching sport. I also enjoyed writing short stories, reading and traveling and I think meeting so many interesting personalities from so many different walks of life, gave me a push to improve myself and to try and write some interesting facts about certain subjects or personalities.

JON:  What was it about this case that prompted you to follow it so closely and eventually write a book?

DON:  The family came to me when I was editor of their local paper. I felt that after investigating the claims, that Stephen was serving time for someone else. I felt it was something that could happen to anyone's son, daughter or friend. And I knew that if I did not write the book, the truth would never come out. It was always likely that despite my success, the police would try and cover things up and try to discredit my work or attack Stephen Downing.

And as soon I realized Derbyshire police would control their own re-investigation my heart sank - and everyone knew it was likely to become a whitewash. I was also concerned at the time that Downing had served 21 years in prison for the murder - including 4 years over his time -and was likely to remain in prison till he was 60 just because he would not admit to the crime. My own son was 17, the same age as Downing when he was jailed, and perhaps that too sparked my interest. I fought this 'In Denial of Murder' issue through the European Court of Human Rights and eventually defeated the British Government after three and a half years, so that now any prisoner in denial has the basic right to put their case before the Parole Board. I also fought the case through the justice system to overturn his conviction. It was a typical David v Goliath challenge that attracted the public interest. I was fighting for the underdog and won against the odds. It almost brought the government down. It became a battle against two Prime Ministers, two Home Secretaries and a host of top government ministers and police chiefs.

JON:  With non fiction you obviously need to pay much closer attention to facts. What kind of research went into the book?

DON:  I kept a diary of events throughout the 6-8 years of my investigations and research, plus throughout the court proceedings. I also had my tapes, interview notes and cuttings, plus loads of letters from Stephen Downing and a host of other paperwork. It took me several years to put the full case together and locate copy papers - that the police said did not exist and had been burnt, lost or destroyed. I proved they had lied and re-presented the facts to the authorities showing that fresh evidence could help to challenge the original police claims and overturn the conviction. I had to interview about 60 witnesses and informants and traveled all over the UK to meet people and often visited Downing in jail. The police and government finally conceded and offered no challenge to the appeal. It made headlines across the world as Britain's longest ever miscarriage of justice. It even topped Nelson Mandela!

JON:  As a reporter I would imagine you have some stories that you hold a little closer than others. Can you think of any other instances over the years when a story really grabbed you on a level beyond that of a reporter?

DON:  I don't think there has ever been anything quite like this story and one of the attractions in a weird sort of way were the dangers, threats etc and the battle of wills with the police and authorities. My police informants constantly proved them wrong and the evidence contradicted their original claims from 1973 onwards. All these actions made me more determined to seek out the truth. I have worked on several other miscarriage cases and they each have their own dangers and interests but nothing quite so intense as this one. You are not supposed to become emotionally involved but with this case being on my own doorstep, it was so hard not to.

JON:  Parts of the book "Town Without Pity" are being on stage, what brought this about? Was this an idea of yours?

DON:  No it was not my idea but it has worked out very well. Extracts from the book have since been performed on stage several times at various Arts and Drama Festivals. I had to do some readings from my book on national radio (which I don't like doing) and the producers heard me talking and followed the case in the papers. It also attracted the attention of several top actors - including Robert Carlyle, Tam Dean Burn and Gary Lewis, amongst others. Some said they had read the book and were so taken that they asked to perform some extracts live on stage at the London Festival. I was invited to watch and make the introductions. It was the first time I had seen or heard my work presented by professional actors and it brought tears to my eyes. It was so emotional and brought the audience to their feet. They read from about four separate extracts. They too were pleased and wanted to repeat the show and offered to do the same in my own local town where we have a major festival each September. Gary Lewis, who played the father in the film Billy Elliott and also appeared in Gangs of New York, phoned to say he was flying back specially from Rome to keep his promise. A group of actors stayed at my house and again it went down a storm. They have asked to try and work a small stage show for future dates and are keen on appearing in the BBC TV drama planned to be shown next February.

JON:  Did the idea of doing the on stage performances come before or after the book was optioned for a movie?

DON:  It came well after the book etc. The film people bought the rights about two years before I had written the book. They saw my manuscript and battled with ITV and others for the film rights. The book came next and then the stage version - once they had read about the details. I think parts of it convert well to the stage and it could be condensed into a shortened version of the book and film.

JON:  So, you actually came to journalism because of an injury while playing soccer? That's pretty amazing. Do you still follow the sport?

DON:  I am a bit out of shape at the moment. I watch soccer on the TV and go to a few games but need to get out jogging again. Last time I played soccer was 3 years ago in California.

JON:  You mentioned while you were visiting here that you are working on a follow up book to Town Without Pity. What is that book going to be about?

DON:  I would like to write the sequel to Town Without Pity. I might call it 'In Denial of Murder' which was my original working title - and this will also be the working title of the BBC TV drama which we hope to start filming in September. With all the antics of the past 18 months, perhaps the 'Scapegoat' might be a better bet. I am also going to write another crime book about the 'Wrong Body' case which has a bizarre American twist. Just waiting for the publishers to accept it but it has already been bought by the US film makers.

JON:  You've also written a few other books before this one, what are they and what are they about?

DON:  I have written five books in total so far. The first was a sports book produced during the jogging boom of the mid 1980s called 'Running for Fun.'

I have also written a soccer book, and last year completed an autobiographical book on Joe Cocker and his early days in Sheffield. And during my stay in America just recently, I completed a pre-war drama
about 'Mallard' a British steam locomotive that claimed the world steam record from Nazi Germany. It is quite a detective type book that plots how Sir Nigel Gresley used the secrets from French, German and US trains to build the fastest train in the world. It should be released in October.

JON:  And you are still working as a reporter also?

DON:  Not really. I still do the odd report or feature but I am too busy working on new projects and some TV work plus preparing for the final drama script.

JON:  Any ideas for future books?

DON:  I have been to Italy and Germany recently and have several ideas. I hope to start on the 'Wrong Body' book soon and have plans for WW2 detective/spy book. I am also going to Egypt next week for some more research into a project for 2004.

JON:  Do you read fiction? And if so, who and what do you enjoy?

DON:  Not had a lot of time in the past 18 months and find it is distracting when involved in a big project. I enjoy HG Wells, Conan Doyle, Ken Follett, Lynda La Plante and the odd Val McDermid. I also like science fiction with Isaac Asimov.

JON:  You recently spent some time over here in the States driving around with Stephen Booth and Danuta Reah. Anything interesting you can tell us about the trip?

DON:  It is the first time we have toured together although we did one gig in the UK last year. We seem to get on very well. Stephen and I worked for the same newspaper group and left work about the same time to write full time. I don't think either Steve or I are mechanically minded and we had some fun with US automatic hire cars. I hadn't realized Danuta was such a bad flyer too. She hides under the blanket at take off and landing which is a bit disconcerting but she is good company and we had a good chat but I probably bored her to death.

JON:  It seems that while you ran into a fair amount of inept public servants. The fact that Stephen was moved from a cell in Verne to one in Dorchester and they didn't even seem to be aware of it seems pretty strange. Was there a lot of frustrating conversations like the one on the phone with the man who wouldn't identify himself?

DON:  I did not realize just how difficult it would be dealing with British civil servants. It's like the stone wall brigade or denial and incompetence. I think they deliberately delayed and tried to confuse the issue by losing the papers hoping that I would give up. The British legal system takes forever and despite winning my case through the European Courts, the government objected and it took me three and half years to finally win. The appeal process was even worse and six years was fairly quick by today's standards.

JON:  What made you want to write a book on Joe Cocker? I saw him not too long ago and the old boy still had the moves I was amazed!

DON:  I got his ex manager out of jail about three years ago. He was a guy called Terry Thornton. Another of my famous miscarriage cases. I din't know he was into rock at the time but as some reward for my work he let me write about his involvement with Cocker and other pop/rock stars such as The New Faces, Rod Stewart, Cream, Eric Capton, and a host of others. I have the book and can send it to you if you like? My story with Cocker is about the early days in Sheffield. It was a roller coaster affair where Cocker was even booed off stage in Sunderland and Terry paid for him to tour the US Air Force bases in France.

JON:  Does the discipline of working as reporter with deadlines every day help when writing books?

DON:  I think it does. There are many times when it becomes really hard work and you have to set yourself deadlines and provide incentives to achieve your target. There are days when you do no feel like writing at all, and others when you are supposed to be doing something else that suddenly a burst of inspiration comes. It's often a fine balancing act. I cannot work 9-5 anymore but set myself targets per day to get the job done.

JON:  What kind of movies do you enjoy?

DON:  I love WW2 movies and adventure stories in particular. Ideally something combining romance with war or danger. I used to enjoy the Ian Fleming novels of James Bond as a kid and liked the older Bond movies. I also like the older movies withy Michael Caine, The Ipcress File and his Harry Palmer character, plus the B & w films with Humphrey Bogart and Cary Grant.

JON:  I would imagine that as a reporter and also when writing non fiction that you would on occasion run into people who would be, shall we say less than honest? How do you filter out the bullocks from the truth?

DON:  Not sure whether this one question or two? I think you develop a gut feeling as a reporter and you are certainly trained not to accept everything at face value. With working on murder cases, quite often people hype up their role and sometimes it takes a lot of cross examination abd further contact with other witnesses to sort the wheat from the chaff. It's never easy and many people try to con you. Generally it's a process of elimination and making comparison with other parties. This last case - Wendy Sewell murder - was especially difficult because I was interviewing people about 8-9 years ago and which is only just being discussed now, but they were talking of events from nearly 30 years ago. The memory plays tricks and sometimes people are influenced by what they have read or seen since.

JON:  What’s the one thing always in your refrigerator?

DON:  Food. My parents lived through the war and rationing. She always taught me to have something in reserve just in case. Several bottles of water are also useful in case the supplies are cut off or are contaminated. A can of beer and a piece of cheese.